Are you healthy or sick?

healthy or sick

by new to pace.... - 2024-10-05 06:38:22

That is an interesting question.  (I see spell check not  fixed again).  Anyway i am not "sick" but dealing with lack of muscle to help me rise up from a sitting position. Once walking no problems.   Been going to Physical Therapy this past month to see if i can get up.  I am not sick but not well.  This would not fit into your poll.

new to pace

new to pace

by Gemita - 2024-10-05 06:45:00

I am not sick but not well would fit nicely into the Poll as an Option.  Thank you for starting us off and I hope physical therapy will help you to "rise" more comfortably.

poll option( was thinking more of "has your quality of life changed?)

by new to pace.... - 2024-10-05 07:13:54

Am getting ready for another trip and need to get up from sitting on the plane for  3 hours. then climb the 2 steps into the next small  plane.  This time am going someplace where it is to cold for me.  Have not been since i got my pacemaker in 60F as high and 50F as low degree weather.  Had to dig out my winter clothes an of course try them on to see if still fit. 

My current temperature is 90F.

new to pace

Poll options

by Gemita - 2024-10-05 07:39:26

new to pace, yes we do need some clarity.  The Poll is really about whether a person regards himself/herself as “healthy” or “sick” in a general sense, especially because they have a long term heart condition that requires a pacemaker and/or other treatments.

Some patients with multiple, serious health conditions may still regard themselves as being healthy (my husband is one such patient who denies being "ill"), whereas another patient with the same condition(s), may regard themselves as being chronically sick.  

These Poll options are not going to be easy are they?

Hi Gemita

by piglet22 - 2024-10-05 08:46:42

I take part in a long term medically based survey of vitamin D intake and possible long Covid effects.

Once a month, I fill in a survey form and give occasional blood samples.

They ask questions about your general health and your mental health.

They use a slider so you can set a position on a scale of 1 to 100 which goes from worst possible health this month to best possible health this month. I usually set it to about 60.

There are also tables with headings for separate categories. There can be between five and ten headings.

A question might be "Do you think you are healthy today?" The headings might be Strongly agree, Agree, Neither agree or disagree, Disagree, Strongly disagree.

I've often wondered about where I stand on the scale of things, not necessarily health or illness, as often you only have yourself to judge against.

Sometimes figures are published that give you an idea. The average UK individual uses, not consumes, on average 150-litres of water a day. I use about 2-litres a day, a fraction of the average, so I am a very low user of mains water. What doesn't go into the average is the fact that most of my water use is rainwater and doesn't get measured.

I probably don't drink enough water out of the tap, but water can be taken in many forms, juices, beers etc.

Age wreaks havoc with health. 50-years ago I would say I was quite healthy. Now I would say I am healthy enough for day-to-day activities, don't need additional help, but long runs or climbs are definitely off the menu.

Oddly enough, I can't remember any medic asking me, very wise, other than "how are you today?"

"Fair to middling, mustn’t grumble"

In sickness and in health

by Selwyn - 2024-10-05 09:06:48

If we look at being  healthy ( a state of complete physical and mental  and social well being )  and disease (a diagnosed illness), there is a spectrum. Sickness comes somewhere towards the illness end. The prevalence of disease may well be reducing with preventative medicine, though new diseases are recognised from time to time ( eg. ME, Long Covid etc.) 

The World Health Organization made a  definition of health in 1948  as  ‘not merely the absence of disease or infirmity but a state of complete physical, mental and social well-being’. But this utopian vision is an unattainable ideal, bearing no relation to the struggles of real people in an imperfect world. Who is completely healthy?

Self certification of sickness ( The UK government's Med 3 sick note was replaced by the 'Fit note' in 2010 ) is widespread. In some areas of the UK we have 25% of the eligible work force presenting as 'sick'. There’s been an increase of 55% in sickness absence of worker rates since 2019 in the UK.   Clearly, either health has deteriorated with time, or the definition of 'sickness' has changed.  Is this physical, mental, or social sickness?

I would put it to you that no one with a pacemaker/ICD is healthy. Sickness encompasses a feeling of negative well being.

Selwyn

by piglet22 - 2024-10-05 10:07:56

It amuses me to see these ads on the TV.

There's the one with that perfectly muscled, tall dark and handsome bloke standing on a rock or something, shooting an arrow through a bottle of something expensive.

That would be someone's healthy vision, God like, perfect as a Greek sculpture.

For all we know, he might have a pacemaker and not happy with his lot in life. Needless to say, I won't be volunteering.

In my old industry, self-certification just meant an extra 12-days leave to some.

Certainly, before my diagnosis and subsequent pacemaker, I felt very ill. The pacemaker restored my health to what it should have been. So maybe 50% well to 90% at the flick of a switch. As the years go by, that leap is slowly being eroded as joints fail etc., etc. This can easily lead to your spirits being dragged down, and the pace of modern life doesn’t help, possibly leading to more problems.

As such, it must rate as one of the most successful treatments going. From one bloke working in a shed with a handful of components, to a truly fully programmable electronic substitute for our own failed complex pacemaker.

Healthy

by Lavender - 2024-10-05 10:48:53

Yesterday I went for my biannual pcp checkup. They do a physical including blood work and two questionnaires on mental health, exercise, personal safety, etc..

My pcp declared that I was healthy! I rolled my eyes. I mentioned the pacemaker and lead that needs revision. He said you are one of the healthiest people your age that I see. You will have a long good life. So I am going to say that I am healthy. Lol

The medical group website for one of the factions of this practice also states the definition that Selwyn used. They list five aspects of health:

Being “healthy” can mean so many different things to different people. Believe it or not, it’s not just tied to physical appearance, although many people are quick to assume that it is. “Skinny” doesn’t necessarily mean you’re healthy and in the same breath, a high BMI doesn’t necessarily correlate to an unhealthy individual. There are a lot of factors that go into the determination of whether you are truly living a healthy life.

Whether it’s the food you consume, the amount of physical activity in your routine or the social activities you engage in, it all ties together. According to The World Health Organization (WHO) the word health is, “a state of complete physical, mental and social well-being,” and this includes the use of personal and social resources to ensure an individual can function throughout their everyday lives. In other words, if your body can effectively manage threats to your system (physically, mentally or emotionally), you are considered to be healthy. There are some general signs that indicate if you are in good health from a physical and mental perspective:

You are eating a diet that is well-rounded and includes lots of whole foods.

You can effectively manage a full range of emotions.Too often, people think you have to be happy all the time. That is far from the truth. Happiness feels significantly more wholesome when you feel a range of emotions in-between those happy moments. A true sign of good emotional well-being is the ability to embrace and manage a range of emotions, recognizing they are not permanent.

You have enough energy to get through your day and complete your daily to-do list.

You feel rested when you get up. 

You include moderate exercise and movement into your daily routine. 

When thinking about your overall health, it is important to remember that it is all about having a healthy balance between your mental and physical wellness.

Survey Questions - Healthy or Sick?

by DoingMyBest - 2024-10-05 13:28:41

It's apparent there are many facets to the “sickness and health” question. To me three of the most important are “comfort,” “independence,” and “longevity.” It’s obvious to me that “sick” puts me to one end of the scale on each of these, and “health” puts me on the other.

Thinking of how I’d structure a survey question I also thought of “fitness,” “pain,” and “ability to function.” Another version of pain is “misery index.” Upon further reflection, I think these are all implicit to “comfort” and “independence.”

Based on these thoughts, here is my initial contribution towards Gemita’s survey questions:

Are you healthy or sick?

1. I am able to function entirely independently at a high level, not constrained by any physical or mental shortcomings. I expect to live longer than others my age.

2. I am mostly independent and able to function well with only minor help from doctors and drugs. I have a healthy lifestyle and few physical or emotional limitations. I expect to live a full or slightly better than normal lifespan.

3. I am somewhat dependent on doctors, drugs, and perhaps some dietary restrictions to keep me healthy, but otherwise am able to function at a satisfactory level without undue dependence on others for my physical and mental needs. My physical limitations are minor and not a serious issue. I'm hopeful I'll live a normal lifespan.

4. I am seriously dependent on doctors, drugs, dietary restrictions and perhaps some periodic procedures to keep me healthy. I have some significant physical limitations. I may need some extra help to keep me emotionally centered. I'm concerned that I won't live a full normal lifespan.

5. I am entirely dependent on others to provide for my physical and mental needs. I have little doubt that I'm not going to live a normal lifespan.

Excellent feedback

by Gemita - 2024-10-05 13:52:15

new to pace, Piglet, Selwyn, Angry Sparrow, Lavender, DoingMyBest

I always thought your original post on health and sickness Angry Sparrow would make an excellent Poll one day and I don’t think I and other members at the time were wrong.  I just didn’t know how I could possibly go about creating one.  I realised then and I realise now that to receive sensible answers for such a Poll requires a great deal of thought and I am grateful for all the responses I have so far received.  They have all been individually excellent and I have got more than I expected from such a poorly thought out post from me.

As a bonus, I feel I have been given permission to be ill, so that is a relief when I am not feeling at my best.  Who is completely always healthy physically, mentally or emotionally though?  I don’t think any of us can claim to be. 

All your contributions have been valuable and I can go away and start making an excellent Poll for your final approval before it is placed on the home page.

A first attempt

by Gemita - 2024-10-05 20:50:37

POLL

In the context of having a heart condition and needing a pacemaker or ICD, do you regard yourself as a Sick or a Healthy person and to what extent?  Please tick one statement below that "most" applies to you?

1. I am sick and unable to function without some help from another person and I sometimes have a feeling of negative well being.

2.  I am healthy and mostly enjoy a feeling of complete physical, mental and social well being and can function independently of others.

3.  I am neither sick nor healthy.  I am mostly able to function independently but on occasions I may need some help.  I feel neither negative nor positive about my health.

4.  I know I have an illness but I choose to ignore it and to live my life as though I am healthy.

5.  I know I am considered to be well in the eyes of my doctors but I do not always feel well or feel that I am completely free from illness. I may have feelings of anxiety.

poll

by new to pace.... - 2024-10-05 23:13:46

You mean only to the heart that is holding us back?  Not someother problem. For me my the pacemaker "cured my slow heart beats and pauses."  other health issues are slowing me.

new to pace

Good point

by Gemita - 2024-10-06 03:09:08

new to pace, I want everyone in the Pacemaker Club to feel able to complete the survey, so I will modify my Poll later today

Order of poll questions

by Rch - 2024-10-06 15:43:08

Gemita, This is a good start on your mission to understand the general well being of the club members. While the demography of the club members is varied, it does give some insight into how we perceive ourselves subjectively as a group. My only suggestion would be the order in which the questions would be ranked as it might have some impact on the subjective answers. You can start with #1 Healthy and as you  proceed to #5 Sick or vice versa. The # we choose may also serve indirectly as a tool to understand where people rank themselves akin to the pain scale, generally 1-10. This is only a suggestion! Thanks  

Rch

by Gemita - 2024-10-06 18:26:05

Rch, thank you.  I understand what you are saying about the order of options, especially as I thought the step by step increase health to sickness was so well thought out in other members’ contributions.

I will now attach a new draft of my Poll but have left the option order untouched for the moment.  I will have a look at this.  I seem to have touched on a different theme and positioned the two extremes “together”, since I feel that neither extreme is likely to be accurate for the vast majority of us in the older age group, whereas the middle path might perhaps be more likely.  The two additional options have been given because they very much reflect the mood here

Revised Poll

by Gemita - 2024-10-06 18:30:06

POLL

Are you Healthy or Sick?  

Please tick one statement below that "most" applies to you:-

(I am defining Healthy as being a state of physical, mental and social well being and Sickness as experiencing discomfort, illness, leading to a lack of physical, mental or social wellbeing). 

1.  I am mostly healthy and able to function independently at a high level, not constrained by any physical, mental or social difficulties.

2.  I am sick and often dependent on others to provide for my physical, mental and social needs. 

3.  I am neither Healthy nor Sick all the time.  I have periods of both good health and of sickness, periods when I fluctuate from needing some support, to periods when I feel completely well and independent.  

4.  I have a chronic health condition(s) but I try to live as near normal a life as possible, despite restrictions because of pain, mobility difficulties, and other symptoms.

5.  I am considered to be well in the eyes of my doctors but I do not always feel that I am completely free from illness and this can cause anxiety in the absence of a diagnosis.

poll answers

by new to pace.... - 2024-10-06 20:39:23

to me it seems i still have difficulty fitting how i feel into your answers.  My heart has been doing well, since so one calls me anymore.  My spine strength is my current problem, have been in PT for the past month and it ends this week. will know when i come back from my next trip if it is better.

new to pace 

new to pace

by Gemita - 2024-10-07 02:54:28

With respect, why don't you insert a line or two into the Poll questions to show me how to make it more relevant for you?  I have taken out specific reference to healthy or sick in the context of a heart condition and made it more general.  Seems to me that Option 4 might be an option for you, since you clearly have a chronic condition with your joints due to age and wear and tear but you are also very brave and still continue with your activities and travel.

Has this been mentioned?

by sgmfish - 2024-10-07 15:38:56

I've read thru this thread, and I don't think it was discussed whether this poll should focus on just heart issues or overall health. IMO, given that this forum is dedicated to pacemakers, the useful outcome of a poll would probably be to focus on just heart issues.

IOW, let's say I feel healthy when it comes to my heart/pacemaker, but I have severe joint pain that nearly immobilizes me. I might answer that I am very unhealthy due to the joint pain, but wouldn't that mislead the forum into thinking I am unhealth due to my heart when the opposite might be true?

Maybe the poll you have in mind is exactly to "measure" members overall health regardless on their experience with pacemakers; if so, that should be made clear in the introduction (indeed, if the pupose is pacemaker only, that should be made clear too).

Healthy or Sick? Or able to live independently?

by Gotrhythm - 2024-10-07 18:43:54

Interestingly, my Medicare supplement policy annually sends me a form to fill out regarding my overall condition. One of the questions is a 5 point scale about my "health" ranging from 5 (excellant) to 1(poor health.)

I give myself a 4.

As I read your poll, it seems to me the choices are around how sick people are and more around how independently people feel they are able to function. It's a legitimate question, but to me, has little to do with being "sick."

I don't think as fast or react as quickly or see as well as I once did, so I restrict my driving to daylight and roads I know. I used to have a cleaning lady because I'd rather pay for housework than do it myself. Now I have a cleaning lady because I can't keep up with the house without one. I lean on others more than I used to, to run errands for me or tell me how to work my new phone, or to help me decipher a bill. I see more doctors in a month than I used to see in a year.

But none of that is because I'm sick. It's all because I'm old.

Still some way to go

by Gemita - 2024-10-08 04:34:31

To all my friends who have contributed. 

I thought I was setting up an interesting, perhaps fun Poll, on whether we believed we were sick or healthy, but both ends of the scale of sickness and of health and something in between, means different things to each one of us, depending on our age, health condition, ability to adapt to our environment and things like this.  Are you sick or healthy as a Poll subject is turning out to be a nightmare, and very difficult to answer under this general heading, since there is no agreement on what constitutes health, disease or illness.

But I love a challenge and certainly won’t give up.  I will try to put something together that hopefully we can all take part in and enjoy. 

sgmfish, It would certainly be a lot simpler to confine the Poll question to heart patients with devices but the Poll question was intended to be a general one about sickness and health.  None of us are free from other conditions which can directly affect our heart health.  The Poll therefore should focus on “overall health” I feel, but I need, as you say, to make this clear from the start and I am struggling to do this at the moment.

Gotrhythm, the Poll was intended to be on the subject of Health and Sickness in general, that is whether we "believed we were healthy or sick", not perhaps so much about our ability to cope with sickness.  I have to do a bit more work to get the main message for the Poll across when setting it up.   Your final comment about age is another important point to factor in.  The ageing process makes us all more vulnerable to disease rather than to good health

Healthy or sick?

by Gotrhythm - 2024-10-08 16:29:42

Whether we call ourselves sick or healthy I suspect is largely a matter of our personal philosophy--maybe with a large dash of self-concept thrown in.

Regardless of the age-related degenative conditions I deal with, the only time I'll admit to sickness is when I have a cold or the flu. I make a philsophical distinction even then between having a cold which is temporary, and being sick, which is a description of my being, which I strongly reject.

I refuse to call old age a sickness, though I must acknowledge, that should I get the cold or flu, age can make the difference between mildly sick and seriously ill.