welding with a pacemaker

welding

Comment posted by parfab on 2015-10-06 01:40.

Hi all in new here ive recently had a pm fitted only 45yrs of age and my forte is fab/welding its a medtronic pm... been in trade 20 odd years still off work as they are saying its not safe because off emf fields they dont know what they are and my hr dept are finding it difficult to get some one to do it i reside in uk scotland and i am desperate to get back to work as i hav 4 of a family oldest being 18..13..12.and youngest 6 and stat sick pay aint cuttn it now need info any help would b most appriciated thanx in adavce b safe
Thanx in advance.

4 Comments

EMF, RF, welding

by Theknotguy - 2015-10-09 02:10:40

You didn't say if it was MIG, TIG, or arc welding.

I don't do welding but have been doing research (as a PM owner) into how the PM is affected by EMF, RF, and other fields. You can also contact PJinSC via the private message option on this forum. He works in a power plant in the USA around 1400 volts and above.

What PJ and I have found out so far is the warnings are extremely cautious. In most cases, you don't have to worry. PJ's brother got a PM and he's doing 60amp arc welding. But since I don't do welding, you're going to have to contact him directly.

Medtronic's white paper on EMF fields is to keep the PM between 6 (152mm) to 12 inches (305mm) away from the electrical source. That means in most cases you'd have to be hugging a running electrical motor in order for it to possibly cause a problem.

What I can tell you is I volunteer in a wood shop. I run all the electrical equipment including the 220 volt power saw with no problems.

I was drilling Kreg Jig Pocket Screw holes with a 3/8's inch power drill about a month ago. Forgot about my PM and drilled about 60 holes with my PM lying on the running drill (was using my shoulder to push in the drill) - no problems with my PM. So the Medtronic 6-12 inch warning may just be that - a warning.

One of the wags on the forum said if I messed around with the 220 volt line going into my water heater, I'd probably feel it. Turns out the power line goes into the top of my heater. Got my PM within 6 inches of the 220 volt line. No problems. Am not going to grab a live 220 line as that will kill you. But being next to a 220 line didn't bother my PM.

My son was having a problem with an electrical circuit in his house. Said he'd turned off the line. It wasn't. I grabbed a live 110 volt line. Sore fingers but no problems with the PM. In the UK you have 220 volt so it's a different story there.

What I can tell you is that you will need to exercise all safety rules and go over them a second time before doing work. I'm on meds to slow down my heart which in turn slows down everything. So where you might have been able to pull back from something and only get a nick, you won't be able to do that now. I've found that out the hard way with drill bits getting stuck in fingers and had a router bit give me a fast manicure. Don't even think of running a table saw unless it has the Saw-Stop feature, then use foot long push sticks. Otherwise you might leave fingers on the table.

Your guild may have some restrictions too. You'll have to check with them.

Asking a doctor is really hit or miss. Most doctors don't know a thing outside of their profession (at least in the USA) and will err on the overly cautious side. So they'll tell you that you can't do something because they really don't know or they've read a paper that has incorrect information. So it's trial and error for us with the PM's and caveat emptor.

I can go on for a lot longer about EMF fields, electronics, and the like. If you need more specific info, feel free to contact me via the private message area of the forum.

Welcome to the club. Hope everything else goes well for you. Hopefully it will be as they say in the UK, "no worries".

Welding

by Good Dog - 2015-10-09 11:10:29

You should check with your doc and Medtronic. You weren't clear who said it is unsafe. Your employer or the Doc? However, my guess is that you should be able to resume welding with some precautions.I assume you are talking about arc (electric) welding. If the doc allows, you should be able to do some test welds and see if you can feel any negative impacts from it. They can also then interrogate your pacemaker to see if it had any effect (electrical interference).
If there is concern, it also may be possible to wear a shield over your chest as protection. That would be a last resort.
If it is just your Doc that says no, get a 2nd opinion.
They say you should not use a chain saw with a pacemaker, but I have used one many, many times without a problem. I do try to take precautions like keeping it a fair distance from my PM.
You certainly don't want to do anything that would endanger your health, but at the same time, there are some that can be a little overzealous on the side of safety. You are doing the right thing by exploring this issue as thoroughly as possible.
Sincerely,

Dave

I'm the wag!

by donr - 2015-10-10 03:10:20

Makes a difference whether or not the water heater was on at the time.

Mine just happened to be on carrying a full 30 Amps at 220V.

No current, no magnetic field, no effect on PM.

Also - voltage alone will not kill you - it takes the amperage that it pushes through you. I've taken well over 300 volts from one arm, to the other in an EE microwave lab from the power supply to an acorn sized electron tube - back before solid state electronics. No ill effect. That particular power supply was only capable of putting out a few millliamps, so it did me no harm - now if it were capable of putting out a few Amps, like our house hold power, and it went trough me, it would have been a different story.

Before I started my EE studies, I saw a man walk up to a 440 Volt Motor Generator set & reach out to touch a large cable connected to the device at a large bolt connection. I was about to tackle him to save him from his foolishness. He saw me in time & stopped - momentarily - to tell me he appreciated my concern, but what he was about to do was perfectly safe - if you knew what you were doing. You see, he was NOT grounded & would not have completed the circuit to get fried. He was standing on a thick, dry rubber insulating mat He merely wanted to see if there were any unusual vibrations at the connection - they had just turned the machine on for the first time. So I didn't tackle him & he touched it - w/o ill effect. That was 54 yrs ago. I still think he was dumb!

Donr

From My earlier Post

by PJinSC - 2015-10-10 05:10:14

Here is what I posted back in June of this year. As of today, my brother-in-law has done MIG and TIG welding and has had no ill effect. People are overly concerned with the EMF fields, but the PM and leads are shielded themselves. Just don't get in the circuit.

Just perusing the recent messages today and had to add this. I have posted and commented many times (as have others) about how I have exposed myself and my CRT-P to electromagnetic fields (EMF) in many conditions, from huge power generators all the way down to how I hold my cell phone. I always inserted the disclaimer that I did not do welding. My brother-in-law was recently told he needed an ICD due to a-fib and prior damage from two heart attacks. His EP originally wanted to implant one of the new Boston Scientific S-ICDs. My brother is a professional welder using all of the common methods, so he and I discussed what they had planned. After some research of my own, I recommended that he tell his doctor about the welding up front. The doctor did some research (imagine that?) and decided to implant a Boston Scientific CRT-D because he felt it would be least affected by EMF. That was three weeks ago and my brother decided he was feeling recovered enough to find out, so he went out and fired off his arc welder, did some passes holding at his normal 16-18 inches, and felt nothing. He called me afterwards, so I know he is still alive.

So, to all that are worried about EMF affecting your PM, if a 60 amp arc welder didn't make his PM act up, a laptop, Wi-Fi router, smartphone, Apple watch, electric watch, keyless entry fob, hybrid car, airport metal detector, or most any other electrical device, other than the one your device nurse places over it to put it in test mode, is not going to affect your PM either.

You know you're wired when...

You trust technology more than your heart.

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