Pacemaker removal

Why do I want to get it removed? It has been turned off for over 7 months. I fainted only once--in the hospital--following a very strong dose of a narcotic to which I exhibited a violent negative response. I was then pressured into getting a pacemaker. I never fainted either before that day nor since. Three expert doctors have told me that it can come out. I have not had any other symptoms. Why should I keep it? It's ugly, irritating, and hasn't improved the quality of my life. There was nothing wrong with my life before it went it.

Do you know for a fact or is that just a thought that my driver's license can be revoked for having it removed?

6 Comments

Pacer removal

by golden_snitch - 2011-08-19 01:08:19

Hi!

I understand why you want to have it removed, and from everything you are telling us it really seems like you do not need it (and might have actually never needed it). Go for a removal, if three expert doctors have agreed that it can come out, and if nothing has ever happened in the seven months it was switched off. Why have a foreign object in your body that is not needed? It sounds very much like the guidelines for pacer implant were not followed at all when they pressured you to get one.

When I have had a general anaesthetic, I usually get 2nd degree heart blocks afterwards for a while, but they disappear again. The first time that happened was in 2004 during a surgery, but I ran around without a pacer pacing my ventricles until 2008 doing perfectly fine. And in 2008 I only needed the upgrade because I had to go back on antiarrhythmic meds and those caused heart blocks. But as long as I got the blocks only during general anaesthesia, my cardios said that we could wait with a dual-chamber pacer because narcotics can cause heart blocks even in otherwise perfectly healthy people.

Whenever people come to this forum and ask about pacer removal, most of us usually ask them how much the pacer is pacing because even if it's just 1%, that could be exactly the episode when they would otherwise pass out and for instance have an accident. When they are not paced at all, I think most of us would suggest that to have the pacer turned off for a while before going for a complete removal.
Now, you have already had it turned off for months and nothing went wrong, so I completely understand why you are ready for a removal now, and I think if I'd be in your shoes, I might decide so, too.

Good luck!
Inga

Pacemaker Removal

by SMITTY - 2011-08-19 03:08:45

Hello BFMGAGE,

I can't imagine having driving privileges suspended if you had an unnecessary PM removed, but different states have different rules, some of which, in my opinion, are stupid. But if in doubt you might consider asking the DMV in your state what the rule is.

As Snitch said, if after two years of the PM being off and you haven't had a need for it, why keep it. Getting the leads removed may be something to give some thought. By now they are imbedded in tissue and may come out easy or can very be difficult. They are such small wires, they are likely to impeded the blood flow through the vein they are in, so as for me, I would be inclined to just leave them be.

Now for my story on having a PM turned off. I got my first PM in 2000 at age 71. For the first three weeks things could not have been better. Then I went for that first checkup and I have no idea what was changed, but the PM started shocking me. Of course I was told time after time that my problem was not caused by the PM. When it started I was getting shocks only a few times a day but as the months went by they became much more frequent. By then it was apparent that I was not going to get help from the quack that implanted it, so after about 2.5 years I asked to have it turned off. I had gotten it for bradycardia that gave me a heart rate between 55 and 60. The quack objected and even offered to remove it, but I didn't know what would happen so I declined that offer.

For the next three years with the PM was off I noticed no difference except no shocking. I had no shocks and a heart rate in the 50 - 60s but I had lived with that for more than 40 years. But a problem with shortness of breath cropped up and a different Dr recommended that I have it turned back on. It didn't solve my SOB problem completely but it did help. The shocking came back and I had to get that stopped, which they did by deadening the affected nerve. As the months went by my bradycardia got worse and if I didn't have a PM already in place I would have had to get one. So, I lucked out.

I know you are a lot younger than me which means your activities are different. But unless that PM is bothering you or interfering with some of your activities you might consider leaving it in place for, as you know, we cannot foresee the future. With it off the PM batteries should still be good 15 to 20 years down the road.

Good luck to you on whatever your decision.

Smitty

Smitty's Comments.

by Andersen - 2011-08-19 06:08:21

Excellent comment. I agree with him.

Drivers License

by ElectricFrank - 2011-08-21 12:08:40

It depends a lot on your states policies. Calif is a bear in this regard. If they get word of a change they will sometimes suspend a drivers license subject to review. The problem is the waiting list can be a month or more.

Since you have the agreement of your docs about taking it out I would just discuss the drivers license situation with them. Knowing in advance could save you a lot of grief.

I agree with Smitty as long as it works for you. Otherwise, just be prudent and go for it.

frank

Pacemaker removal

by shannondale - 2011-08-31 08:08:53

My dual-chamber pacemaker was originally implanted in less than 24 hr. after another major surgery for removal of a cancerous growth. I was told I needed it while I was in ICU recovering and was told that it was because they could not stabilize my BP and HR. I have wondered ever since if the problem was related to the anesthesia and was possibly unnecessary. Earlier this year in March I had to have a generator replacement due to the battery wearing down. After the outpatient procedure, I began to show symptoms of infection - pain, swelling, etc. I went back to the doctor several times. Initially, I was not given any antibiotics at all, but finally was prescribed Keflex. This did no good and eventually, I was taken off of that and told not to take any antibiotics because it would mess up testing. I was sent for blood tests to grow cultures and the results were negative. Later, I began to have fever and chills. I was immediately put in the hospital and given IV antibiotics ( Vancomycin) for 3 days and then the infected pacemaker and leads were removed. Blood tests and cultures this time indicated I had MRSA and was they admitted it was caused during the pacemaker replacement surgery. After a couple of days, my left arm swelled up and after an ultrasound was performed, it was determined that I have a blood clot in my left upper arm due to the surgery. I was then placed on blood thinners. I was discharged from the hospital after 8 days and went to my daughter's house for 5 wk. so she could do wound treatments and I could receive at-home nursing care for the IV antibiotic infusions and the INR testing for my blood thinner while they wait for my blood clot to dissolve. The IV Vancomicin was suspended after 6 wk., but I may be on blood thinners from 3-6 months. I went back to the PE Clinic last week for a follow-up appointment. I was told I was doing well and to come back in 1 yr. I was told by several doctors while I was on heart monitors while I was hospitalized that they didn't think I needed a pacemaker. Originally, I was told by my PE doctor that a couple of wk after the pacemaker removal that they would implant a new one on the right side. Now, I'm being told I don't need one? I'm wondering if I ever needed one. I have been monitoring my HR since I was discharged and it is usually in the 60s and 70s and I have not felt any irregular beats. A stress EKG was performed by a cardiologist before the initial surgery in 2002 and was normal.

Sorry so long, but I have family members saying I need to pursue a malpractice lawsuit. BTW, I had no idea that I could have my driver's license suspended now that I no longer have a pacemaker.

Pacemaker removal

by BFMGAGE - 2011-09-05 11:09:02

Shannondale,

I am sorry to hear about everything you've been through, which is an awful lot, but am really glad to hear you are okay now.

No one should have to go through what you went through. I've only been through a tiny fraction of that and it's been hell. So I can only begin to imagine what it's been like for you. I had been a very active and healthy 45 year old when I was admitted to the hospital for something else and was told I needed a pm within less than one hour of fainting once. I was confused and in shock and reluctantly agreed. I recently learned that the oral narcotic for pain I was given can cause fainting. When I expressed surprise that the doctors didn't take this into account I was told that doctors may not know what drugs you have been given. They simply don't really take that into account. You seem to have a heart issue, here's a pm! I have also been told on good authority that these decisions are the judgments of a single doctor in a particular instance. Maybe you have an agressive doctor or maybe you don't. Whether you wind up with a pm in a particular situation is a consequence of their judgment (and whether they want to observe you for a little while or not). An article that came out in the 1990s indicated that as much as 20% of the pms are unnecessary. That number is probably higher now, since there are a lot more put in now. And doctors get kick-backs from the manufacturers too.

I completely agree that you should pursue a malpractice because no one should have to go through what you've been through. But, I also have learned that doctors are very reluctant to identify another's as a misdiagnosis. Very reluctant! So, I would recommend finding the best lawyer you can find and discussing the particulars of the case. But it could be difficult and doctors will want to drag it out. Nevertheless I think you should try.

I know that some states have clauses regarding how soon you can drive after a loss of consciousness, but I don't know about a removal of a pm.

Good luck and stay well.

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